Girlfriend's guy friend

Hey Man,I think I have a pretty good idea of what you are dealing with. First of all, dont try to understand her. You never will, trust me, even if it seems clear as day. Second, you need to work on not getting upset. This only gets worse with time and will damage your relationship.

I met this girl several years ago while in college. We had a connection between us like I had never felt with any other girl the very first time we hung out. I had never wanted to get serious with any girl, even her. Just wasnt interested with the hassle. Anyway over a period of time we hung out and dated and I found myself spending a lot of time with her so naturally we were getting closer, but I still had goals I wanted to accomplish before I would get any more serious. I made that clear to her. I wasnt mean or pushed her away at all. I was in control of my life. During this time she wanted to progress the relationship and was constantly pushing me to do so. It was like she revolved around me. Did and accepted anything I wanted to do. If our relationship ended, it wouldnt have made a difference in my life and she could see that.

After about a year, I was making accomplishments and didnt care too much about going out or drinking and all the crap I did with my buddies anymore. So I started allowing more and more to our relationship. Eventually I made her the priority over my life and my goals became second to her. Long story shortened I became serious like she wanted because I decided I wanted to also. I was good with that. She was too, very happy.

Anyway, the more my life revolved around her the less she revolved around me. I didnt understand and it frustrated me. She began to do things that went against our so called serious relationship that I didnt like. I drove myself nuts trying to figure it out. Needless to say, I found the tables had turned very quickly. And I began to appear jeallous and controlling and wound up feeling like a fool. It amazed me cuz I was only doing what she wanted the whole time I knew her.

My lesson learned, always put yourself before the girl. As long as you are stable and accomplishing your goals she will be following you. Never make her the priority over what you need to be doing for you. You take the lead.

She will test you but you have to blow it off and stay focused on where you are going, even if it means losing her. I have found that women will try to take control but their nature is to be led by their man. If you give them control they will make you a chump and will not be respected by her or anyone else. This is your life, its her choice to accompany you or not.

A "serious" relationship should not change you or your goals. The only difference is you are exclusive to her. You are the same person. If she doesnt act exclusive, dump her and find a better one. Dont go by what she says, go by what she does. Reward her when deserving, blow her off when she is not.

Get back involved with your buddies or do something that will better yourself in accomplishing your goals. She is second. Like Jesse says, YOU are the prize.

With relationships, you have to develop a bluff. If you get to the point you are worried about her, or if you feel like you don't want to live w/o her you have to always bluff. By your Alpha actions she will feel like you will have your life with or without her, but you show her you are glad she is a part of YOUR life. She will test, but never let it break you.

Hope all this helps.

good stuff, man, helps me to re-frame my perspective at this point, b/c sometimes I was getting really pissed at her, at times I was justified and at other times it is just her being her. I think you're absolutely right, I can't expect to figure out why she does or says certain things. I already began incorporating this perspective into my interactions with her this past weekend, and she's already had responses like being more affectionate to me, asking me more detailed questions about what I'm doing in my free time when we're apart, and on Saturday afternoon, even called me three times in a row (and then she joked about it) for short mini-conversations on the phone...she rarely had done that!

I agree, you gotta let a lot of stuff just roll off ya like you don't care, because it can only get worse over time. (but occaisionally I wonder, is this just game playing, why do I have to do this? because we're human??)

so my question to you guys is this...I've been working on PU for about two years now, and have a lot of skills, tools, and experiences that I didn't have before. I think what I've learned here with Jesse's materials and resources, and other similar material, makes me a better person in a lot of situations and relationships. It has helped change how I think and act (and get some hotties!...lol). But what about when it comes to long-term relationships - say, like marriage - are "techniques" like always having a bluff for instance, really a healthy thing? when do you cross the line from sort of managing the psychological aspect of human interactions into just out and out unhealthy game playing? In the healthiest and most perfect relationships, how necessary would these things we discuss here be?

curious as to any thoughts, perspectives, or insight you guys can share...

elespanol

are "techniques" like always having a bluff for instance, really a healthy thing?

From my experience, the fact that you have social value, can STILL get any girl, this will make her know that she can loose you at ANY moment. This is not a frame from an evil perspective, however, it is from a view that will always have her wanting you.

Again, it is not how much YOU like a girl. Its how much attraction and tension you can create in her to want you . . . to keep you. This is the power, this is YOURE option to stay or go. If you turn into someone who becomes needy and wus bag material, the attraction will go away and so will she.

Games not too much. Get past the stupid games part (which you probably are) and keep the smart ones to keep her around. I think you guys are getting to know each other more and more and after a while who knows what will happen . . . you have options ;-)

Have fun creating attraction,
Jobe

I agree with everything Jobe said. My opinions stated above are based on any relationship with a woman. Rather its a FB or marriage. Definately always keep your social value. What you are getting from all of this is knowledge. Base your decisions on knowledge not understanding. Example, you know if you become needy etc. she will haul ass on you. If she says she wants you to spend all your time with her, you dont you will become a wuss and attraction is lost. So decide on knowledge. Unfortunately, all you learn here continues even after marriage.

I think you will always need the bluff, even in marriage. After marriage she may be your priority over you and your goals, but in her eyes she needs to feel second. If they conflict choose your goals. She will not go anywhere. She will always test. Anytime you draw a line, the girl will walk directly to it and act like she will cross unless you change. This is where you do not break. Blow it off and continue doing what you were doing even if you think she will cross it. If she crosses move on, but most of the time she will get bored with her little test and stp harrassing you about whatever it is.

They are retarded. I actually talked to two older ladies at a bar, Sat. night, about marriage and relationships between husband and wives. They were in the mid to late forties. FYI: They were pretty hot too. looked like some rich bitches. They confirmed all I am saying without hesitation. So everything you learn with SS will apply to women for the rest of your life in any relationship. I learned after I had gotten married that nothing really changes between you and your girl.

Hope this makes sense. It is a pretty deep topic. LOL

It amazes me... like you said you started implementing these things and you can almost suddenly see the difference in how she acts. That should make you feel good. I have done similar things myself. It kinda seems like they will tell you stuff and do things to get you all screwed up to where you begin to try pleasing her. Thats when you become the chump and she loses interest. Then you think if you put her second that she will feel crappy about you and lose interest but she actually begins to make more of a positive effort. Its just better to have goals and work on accomplishing them, and in your spare time give her some attention. She will feel like you are leading her, which is what they want.

Look forward to hearing what happens.

They are indeed retarded. I couldn't agree with duckj71 and Jobe more. After I have been taking a different perspective the last several days, conversation-wise she's much more upbeat on the phone with me this week, much more interested in me and what I'm doing.

However - and if I"m being a wuss or needy here, tell me - but she still is managing/controlling how much we get together.

I would like to see her more than 2 or 3 times a week. 5 months into it - it would be nice to just hang out an hour or two at nite during the week, one or two nites. And for a while, we were doing that. But now she's either working late, or working out after work, or taking work home, or tired and going to bed early (but then I find out the next day she didn't go to bed early, so we could have hung out). There were a couple stretches where we slept at each other's place 7 or 8 nights in a row. Granted, we don't get as much sleep, but it's still cool to do. We have different sleep routines, so one or both of us has to compromise (she likes to have music on and the heat going, I like to have no music on and the window open). So I think that may have something to do with it. Anyway, should I say something about her basically eliminating sleeping over during the week, or just act like it doesn't bother me and keep doing my own thing? so far, I haven't said anything. Sometimes, when she sleeps at my place on a Friday, it seems she wants to bolt first thing Saturday a.m. back to her place. Or if I stay at her place on a weekend, the next morning during coffee or whatever it's like she's got a time frame and I'll get vibes from her that she wants me to leave by a certain time.

Again, I totally agree with what has been posted here esp. by Jobe and duckj71. It works. But is it being a wuss or needy on my part, to not only want to be with a hot, cutie, but to want to be with a hot, cutie who wants to be together 4 or 5 nites a week if indeed it's a serious relationship? I do enjoy the company of women, always have. how long do I give this before I decide it's not going in the direction that I want it to? or should I just take a chill on all this and not worry about it?

In any event, after having in the past had a few relationships that lasted too long (2+ years) and weren't going anywhere (I wasn't really into the girl), and now being 36, I don't want to spend too long with my current g/f if it's not going anywhere.

elespanol

Review what you wrote. Dis-associate yourself from what you wrote then read it. You might be answering yourself ;-).


I was JUST in a similar situation. I created attraction in this women last semester. Great times but it didnt go anywhere. Moreover shes a flake. It was a casual relationship that could have been more, but in reality its not. Over the summer I didnt wait for her because I was with other women ;-) which REALLY opened my eyes to QUALITY women. Once this semester came we hung out, hooked up alittle, then she started flaking out on ME! SHES CUT OFF!! DONE! Shes not even potential. I gave her a little slack to redeem herself. My time is respected. And so is yours. If its not valued, shes not going to change, so i moved on. Great experience though.

Bottom line, Get what YOU want out of life! If the situation is not what you prefer, you have an obligation to YOURSELF to change it for YOU. I havent read the whole thing but if shes not respecting your time, call her out. Hopefully you have with hers. If it happends again . . . later Ms.
You are #1 in the relashionship (Inner-game).

Maybe write a list of what you GENERALLY want in a woman. Write something you like about her. What is it that she brings to the relationship? If you KNOW you deserve more, get more.

Have fun creating attraction,
Jobe

Make your move?

elespanol,

My older brother, who is much more experienced than me, is in a similar situation. He's had this girlfriend for a year now and recently they haven't even seen each other for a month. I know this because my ex-girlfriend does business with him and he told her all about what was going on. He even told my ex that his and his lady's 1-year anniversary came up and she didn't even acknowledge it. Now this is where I was taken by surpise: my ex advised my brother to break up with her because it seems like my bro's GF is pushing him away. My ex told my bro, "Be a man and break it off." You got the women's perspective.

The way I see it, relationships work by putting in the time; the time you want to put in on your part by hanging out during evenings. She's not putting that time in and if this continues, the relationship will deteriorate. Again, I've said it from the beginning, this girlfriend of yours, her behavior, has always raised an eyebrow with me. You're right; you're 36 years old and you don't need to be wasting time on someone who's not interested, or committed to the long haul. Reevaluate your situation.

Jay Olie Espy

If you are wanting more than this chick is giving... I would start looking for other chicks to fill in the void. Maybe not break it off with her but definately be looking for other girls to hang out with. You may be wasting your time with this chick and missing out on others and wind up kicking yourself in the ass.

I agree with JOBE, reread all you have written and read it from a third person perspective.

#1 rule is too not be a wussy

She's flirting with him to see what your going to do about it! Turn into a wussy? Be a man about it and flirt with her girlfriend, and her other friends, if she likes you, she'll stick around. Don't get too caught up in one girl, keep your options open, look for others to flirt with, see how she likes it. Do onto others as they would do onto you. Good luck man....

attraction

Hi guys, Ive just read through this whole thread which is excellent,but it has left me a little concerned!Iv been with my g friend for 5 months now, to begin with she was always 2nd or even 3rd on my priority list!

But recently (last 2 months) I have wanted to spend more time with her and she has wanted to spend more time with me!I see her everyday, and she's now staying at my place for a few weeks over the festive season.I dont really go out anywhere without her and neither does she,simlply because we dont want to go out without eachother.Im always saying to her it really doesnt bother me if she wants to go out with her friends without me , she always declines!

I usually make our social decisions,but if she really wants to do something ill go along with it unless its something i really dont want to do!I think its less of what we doing and more of that we doing it toegether that she likes.

From what i can see (i could be blinded here) it seems she enjoys my company and cant get enough. She tells me this all the time,and i feel the same.

Am I in danger of killing the attraction here? She is quite sensitive and if i started blowing her off,she would be pretty bummed and prob start doing her own thing!and we'd both be feeling shit.

I know this post is a little confusing and a bit vague,didnt feel like writing a book that nobody would read!

theriddler
PS.I havent changed the way I act around her E.g.busting on her etc.

Oh my freaking God! You actually want to spend time with your girlfriend and enjoy each other's company?! That is terrible! What are you thinking man?!

I'm sure you're not appreciating my sarcasm here, but read what you wrote, Riddler. I think it's awesome that you and your lady have become inseperable. Isn't that what having a relationship is all about? Otherwise it would be empty.

Why are you afraid that you'll lose attraction? She now always wants to be around you, so apparently you've done something right, so keep doing it. Yes, every once in a while you might do a keep away, like have a guys night out so you two have time to miss each other; but at this point, let's just say doing a "random" freeze out as if she were a girl you were not dating would be stupid.

Bringing this back to elespanol situation, he wants to spend more time with his girlfriend because that's what couples should be doing, and you're freaking out because you are spending time with yours. Appreciate what you have.

J O E

Riddler,

Doesnt sound like you have anything to worry about right now. There may be a day where she decides to go out with her friends. The attitude you have now is what you need to keep. Let her go. For now its awsome that the both of you are spending time together. In elespanol's situation, he was bugging out because of his gf's actions. Which in turn was driving him nuts. The main point is, though the relationship is progressing, you dont change. Don't revolve your life around hers. Sounds like you are on a good path. Just keep it there. If you wind up wanting the relationship to progress further, doesnt mean you change. When I say blow her off, that meant when she begins to make different choices that may feel like she is excluding you, blow her off. For now you must be doing things right. Keep going at it. Have fun!

Later

You're way past the need for attraction. You're moving firmly into an exclusive long term relationship with this woman. Everything you do from here on out is about helping her decide if she wants you as a permenant part of her life.

It's already on her mind if she's ditching friends to hang with you and you're living together (short term or not).

I don't know where you are in life, but if an exclusive LTR isn't your thing, open a new post asking for how to keep her expectations in line.

If the thought of having her long term appeals to you, start raising her LTR buying temperature with some playful teasing.


'I sure see you a lot. You're not gonna get weird and propose to me are you?' Don't let her answer, stack. Watch her facial expression.

'I've come to a decision.' pause, pull out a small box and show it to her. 'I like these cufflinks.' Open box to reveal cufflinks. Again, WATCH her reaction.

And be sure to invite Jesse to the wedding. He'd like that.

Jay Olie Espy,

It's been a while but it's turned out I was wrong about my assumptions on a lot of things with my g/f...for one she's just never had a serious relationship like this before...so that explains some of her behavior and comments at times, like when she tried to seemingly push me away at times...as we've gotten to know each other better a lot of her defense mechanisms have gone down (still there sometimes, but is a lot better)...having spent some time w/ her family too, who're a lot of fun, I can see where she gets some of these defense mechanisms....

one thing I've been noticing as I look at patterns of behavior of things she's done and said, and how she acts in general, I think she's a pretty trustworthy girl...she always comes through (calling when she says she will, coming over when she says she will, and generally being reasonable about compromise situations and such)

so we've spent every night together since thanksgiving, which has been great, and we're talking about moving in together in the spring...(which is both exciting as well as a little scary at the same time...!!)

anyhow wanted to give ya an update...I'm hoping to start posting more again in the new year - happy holidays and Happy New Year!!

elespanol

elespanol,

Thanks for the update. It did seem she was adjusting to a new situation. I hope it continues to work out for you too.

Happy New Year,
J O E

Hey lounge buds,

Just wanted to give everyone an update on this topic...a few days ago, I re-brought up this topic directly with my girlfriend...I asked her something to the effect, 'hey what was ever the deal with your friend John...you sure acted suspect towards him that day at the ballgame last fall, did you two ever date? ever hook up?...'

I didn't ask accusingly, and I truly just wanted to know, and was prepared for any answer she may give...

her response...what are you talking about?? no, and no...said she COULD have dated him, but never wanted to, never felt attraction for him (more good proof Jesse's material is the real deal!), although he had had a crush on her...I then asked her 'why were you so excited about him at the game then??...why did you keep talking about John to me and your friend Mary after John had left?? she said, I wanted to set those two up, and wanted Mary to like him!!... Ohhhhh, I thought, and a light bulb went on for me, that made sense....

so, that was that...she never felt attraction for the guy...(I still think she was doing a little mild flirting with him in front of me during the game, but I now understand what was going on and that it was harmless)...and accordingly, no reason for me to have worried about it.....

Thank you to everyone who shared their perspectives, opinions, and experiences on this...you helped me with new skills, as well as reminded me of ones I already had...you guys are the best - thank you!!

elespanol

I hope you learned that most of the things in a relationship are really not worth worring about. The fact that you worried is something you can work on in the future. You see your woman "flirting" but you know and BELIEVE that YOU are the OBJECT OF DESIRE (not her) so you dont think, "oh man is she attracted to him?!" and other needless worry. Yes this IS a sign of insecurity HOWEVER it can be rooted out. Youre on your way.

Glad to hear youre breathing easier

Have fun,
Job

Jobe,

Thanks, man.

take it easy,

elespanol